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On Oct. 30, 2004, Richard Orchs appealed to "Left Activists" posting "More Reasons to voter for Ralph Nader"

Let me be a little glib. No harm intended, it's just been a stressful run-up to the electon....

I SAY: Vote "Cobb" to build something besides Nader's ego."

1. YOU SAY: "Voting for Nader is the only way we can vote against the war.

I SAY "only?" That's factually incorrect (Your command of logic is not giving "left activists" a very good name - glib, sorry). People can vote for David Cobb and vote against the war, plus, they'll be voting for a party. (Yea, I know about the "people's party", and Nader is faking it. Read "Democratic Promise" by L. Goodwin). The libertarians are against the war too if I'm not mistaken.

2. YOU SAY: .... We should do the most for the greatest number...

I SAY Sounds nice rolling off the "left activist" tongue, but think.... If votes for Nader in swing-states gives the outcome to Bush, real people and real environmental gems will be irreversibly damaged. Some lives will be literally cut short. No, not many privilaged middle class lives, tho I could imagine a pregnant middle-class 17-year old dying in a backroom abortion after Bush gets done with the Supreme Court.

David Cobb, Green, has used a pragmatic "safe-state" strategy that will grow a party for future generations and not alienate potental future party members.

3. YOU SAY: If Bush gets re-elected, a groundswell of activism like the 60's can be predicted.

I SAY Meanwhile, Bush will intentionally spend the country into a fiscal hole that will make privatization of New Deal programs the only option (Reagan's Treasury Secretary called this "starving the beast." This is not a conspiracy theory, Robert Ruben, Clinton's Wall Street Tresury Sectretary has said he believes Bush is intentiionally weakening the government to make gutting social security and Medicare a fiscal inevitability).

Meanwhile, the Supreme Court will go towards the radical evangelicals, making torture legal not to mention crushing "1960s" rallys and taking this IMC's server and tracking this e-mail back to you. Then, they'll hire some street thugs and ... you'll be lucky if they bash the windows on your car.

"Yahoo! Bush is re-elected. Lets have a revolution!" A 50-something in Brazil gave me some words of wisdom, "It's easier to prevent a dictatorship than it is to remove a dictatorship." You somehow think that Bush's authoritarian rule won't just send us into a two-decade dark age, from which we "emerge" (If we're lucky, and Bush doesn't get us nuked) to where we are today? The phrase I most often hear uttered from the "ground-swelling masses" these days is "Mooo, Juliette Lewis is such a rocker!"

4. YOU SAY: "John Kerry and many liberals including Green Party members like David Cobb say we cannot "cut and run" from Iraq for humanitarian reasons."

I SAY The glib, comment? Nader has cut 'n run from the green party. Nader's cavelier attitude on this and Iraq is consistent.

The US voting public put Bush into Office, and while in Iraq our president fucked over a country (Yes, our vote put him in office... if it wasn't so close, the Supremes wouldn't have had the opportunity to act). The voting public is partly responsible for Iraq (You'll notice I'm resisting an explicit cheap shot here).

Because of the responsibility above, we as a Nation have a responsibility to leave Iraq in as benign a manner as possible. It won't be easy, because Bush created unalterable facts on the ground, of which he'll do more if Nader helps him get four more years.

Think of this: Nader is elected. He yanks the yankees out. Iran and the majority in Iraq unify, and begin making women wear head covers. Secular moderates in Iraq try to do something, and start to show up tortured and mutilated (can you say raped?). Sinclair and Fox broadcast pictures (only on the 10pm news 'cuz they are graphic). The numbers are in the tens-of-thousands. People on the right and left say, "Ralph, it's a fucking blood bath. You gotta do something." The military guys are saying "Fuck you Ralph. We told you so." "Elements in the CIA are working with former Ollie North shadowy figures trying to figure out how to have Ralph killed so a more stabilizing presence can be put in place." Welcome to the realities of the White House Ralph.

Need I go on? No. Other than to say Ralph Nader is one of my heros and I'm all for revoking corporate consititutional rights. Lets just not be idiots in how we go about it. (that's the glib part ;-)